[Senate Hearing 108-528]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
S. Hrg. 108-528
NOMINATION OF DAWN A. TISDALE
=======================================================================
HEARING
before the
COMMITTEE ON
GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
ON THE
NOMINATION OF DAWN A. TISDALE, OF TEXAS, TO BE COMMISSIONER, U.S.
POSTAL RATE COMMISSION
__________
APRIL 29, 2004
__________
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COMMITTEE ON GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS
SUSAN M. COLLINS, Maine, Chairman
TED STEVENS, Alaska JOSEPH I. LIEBERMAN, Connecticut
GEORGE V. VOINOVICH, Ohio CARL LEVIN, Michigan
NORM COLEMAN, Minnesota DANIEL K. AKAKA, Hawaii
ARLEN SPECTER, Pennsylvania RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois
ROBERT F. BENNETT, Utah THOMAS R. CARPER, Deleware
PETER G. FITZGERALD, Illinois MARK DAYTON, Minnesota
JOHN E. SUNUNU, New Hampshire FRANK LAUTENBERG, New Jersey
RICHARD C. SHELBY, Alabama MARK PRYOR, Arkansas
Michael D. Bopp, Staff Director and Chief Counsel
Johanna L. Hardy, Senior Counsel
Joyce A. Rechtschaffen, Minority Staff Director and Counsel
Jennifer E. Hamilton, Minority Research Assistant
Amy B. Newhouse, Chief Clerk
C O N T E N T S
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Opening statements:
Page
Senator Collins.............................................. 1
Senator Akaka................................................ 2
Senator Lautenberg........................................... 8
WITNESSES
Thursday, April 29, 2004
Hon. Eddie Bernice Johnson, a Representative in Congress from the
State of Texas................................................. 3
Dawn A. Tisdale, of Texas, to be Commissioner, U.S. Postal Rate
Commission..................................................... 4
Alphabetical List of Witnesses
Johnson, Hon. Eddie Bernice:
Testimony.................................................... 3
Tisdale, Dawn A.:
Testimony.................................................... 4
Biographical and professional information requested of
nominees................................................... 11
Pre-hearing questionnaire and responses for the Record....... 15
NOMINATION OF DAWN A. TISDALE
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THURSDAY, APRIL 29, 2004
U.S. Senate,
Committee on Governmental Affairs,
Washington, DC.
The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:00 a.m., in
room SD-342, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Susan M.
Collins, Chairman of the Committee, presiding.
Present: Senators Collins, Akaka, and Lautenberg.
OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR COLLINS
Chairman Collins. The Committee will come to order.
Good morning. Today the Committee on Governmental Affairs
is holding a hearing to consider the nomination of Dawn Tisdale
to be a Commissioner on the Postal Rate Commission. The
Commission reviews the Postal Service's requests for new
domestic mail rates, fees, and mail classifications and makes
recommendations to the Postal Board of Governors. The
Commission may also propose changes in mail classification to
the Postal Service, investigate complaints concerning postal
rates, fees, mail classifications or services that involve
issues of nationwide significance, and hear appeals from postal
customers concerning decisions to close or consolidate retail
post offices. In short, the Commission is instrumental in
helping the Postal Service meet its financial and operational
challenges.
The good news for Mr. Tisdale is that he would join the
Postal Rate Commission at a time when the very direction of the
Postal Service is being debated and reconsidered. The bad news
is that he will be called upon to help bail out a ship that is
taking on water fast.
The Postal Service is the linchpin of a $900 billion
mailing industry that employs 9 million Americans in fields as
diverse as direct mailing, printing, catalogue production,
paper manufacturing, and financial services.
David Walker, the General Accounting Office's Comptroller
General, has expressed concern about the Postal Service's more
than $90 billion in unfunded liabilities and other obligations.
He has also pointed to the need for fundamental reforms to
minimize the risk of a significant taxpayer bail-out or
dramatic rate increases.
Earlier this month the Committee concluded a series of
eight hearings taking an in-depth look at the 35 legislative
and administrative recommendations of the President's
Commission on the U.S. Postal Service. In its final report
issued last July, the Commission described the need for a
vigilant, broadly empowered and independent Postal Regulatory
Board. Among other things, the Commission recommended that the
current rate-setting process, often described as lengthy and
litigious, be replaced with a more streamlined process, that
the regulators should have the authority to clarify and refine
both the scope of mail monopoly and the universal obligation,
recommendations that I would note I disagree with, and that
members of the regulatory board should be chosen solely on the
basis of their technical qualifications and professional
experience.
It has been more than 30 years since the Postal
Reorganization Act was passed. The time has come to reassess
how the Postal Service should adapt to its customers,
competitors, and technology and best fulfill its mission in the
21st Century. The need to preserve a strong and universal
Postal Service is clear, particularly in States with large
rural areas, such as my home State of Maine. Within days,
Senator Tom Carper and I plan to introduce a postal reform bill
that will incorporate many of the Commission's recommendations.
Mr. Tisdale, you have several years of valuable experience
with the Postal Service. I look forward to hearing your
thoughts this morning on what you believe to be the appropriate
role of the Postal Service's regulator.
Before I call on Congresswoman Johnson to introduce our
nominee, I would like to turn to my distinguished colleague,
who has a great interest in postal issues and contributes so
much to our Committee. Senator Akaka.
OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR AKAKA
Senator Akaka. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman. I again
want to say it is so good working with you as always; I have
enjoyed serving with you.
I also want to add my welcome to Congresswoman Johnson. I
am so happy that you are here to introduce our Commissioner.
And welcome to Dawn Tisdale, who the President has nominated to
serve as a Commissioner of the U.S. Postal Rate Commission.
As Senator Collins noted, your nomination comes to this
Committee at the culmination of a series of hearings on the
recommendations of the Commission on the U.S. Postal Service.
And, as Senator Collins said, there is a bill being crafted and
I certainly want to add my support to that bill.
We heard from many people at the hearings, all of whom are
interested in the continued stability and viability of the
Postal Service. Achieving that goal will require the dedication
of individuals such as yourself who will be called on to make
tough decisions. Judging by your biographical information you
submitted to the Committee, your career with the Postal Service
provides you with the experience to do just that.
One of the recommendations made by the Postal Commission
and one that I expect will be in a postal reform bill will be
to significantly strengthen the Postal Rate Commission. I am
hopeful that if confirmed, and I am sure you will be, you will
draw on your experience as a postmaster, postal supervisor, and
letter carrier, especially when the Postal Rate Commission
reviews product and operational matters.
Another recommendation of the Postal Commission which also
should be a part of the postal reform is to create a greater
financial transparency within the Postal Service. As a retired
postal manager, you understand the importance of timely
financial information and I hope you concur that the
flexibility being sought by the Postal Service to set rates
demands that the Postal Rate Commission has access to on-time
and current financial data.
Mr. Tisdale, I believe you will bring a perspective to the
regulatory board which is not represented, so that is important
to all of us.
Madam Chairman, I want to thank you again, and I look
forward to our discussion with this nominee.
Chairman Collins. Thank you very much, Senator.
It now gives me great pleasure to call upon our colleague
from the House side, Representative Johnson, to introduce the
nominee. Thank you for taking the time to be here this morning.
STATEMENT OF HON. EDDIE BERNICE JOHNSON, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF TEXAS
Ms. Johnson. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. It is an
honor and a pleasure to be with you today and I bring the
warmest greetings to you and the Members of the Committee on
Governmental Affairs from the House of Representatives and my
constituents in the 30th Congressional District of Texas.
It is my great honor and great pleasure to introduce Dawn
Tisdale to the Senate Committee. This morning you are
considering his nomination for the U.S. Postal Rate Commission
and I am certainly appreciative.
In my comments I would like to commend President Bush for
nominating Mr. Tisdale to be a commissioner and I would like to
acknowledge Senator Daschle's recommendation to him for this
outstanding nominee. The Senator recognizes that the nominee
certainly has the knowledge and experience to take on one of
the most challenging positions in the Executive Branch. And I
applaud you, Senator Collins and Senator Akaka and all the
Members of the Committee, for the wisdom and grace that you
have shown considering Mr. Tisdale's nomination.
He not only has the qualifications to serve on the Postal
Rate Commission. He also possesses the qualities needed in a
commissioner. He is a retired postmaster. He was postmaster
from 1989 to 2000 in Smithville, Texas and he faithfully
served. And prior to his tenure as postmaster he served as
manager of employee relations in Waco, Texas, my hometown. And
it might sound a little parochial to say this but he has a
great reputation wherever he has served. He started as a postal
delivery person and worked up the ranks and he spent a total of
35 years with the Postal Service.
So I have a great deal of admiration for him because I have
observed him over the years. He is a family man. He is a church
man. He is a community man. He has a very quiet demeanor but he
does not miss much that comes by.
So I thank you so very much for the opportunity to be here
this morning and I hope that he will be confirmed. Thank you.
Chairman Collins. Thank you very much, Congresswoman. I
know that you have a very busy schedule today so if you would
like to be excused at this point, that would certainly be fine
with us. We do appreciate your strong endorsement of the
nominee and your taking the time to introduce him this morning.
Thank you.
Mr. Tisdale has filed responses to a biographical and
financial questionnaire, answered the prehearing questions
submitted by the Committee, and has had his financial
statements reviewed by the Office of Government Ethics. Without
objection, this information will be made part of the hearing
record, with the exception of the financial data, which are on
file and available for public inspection in the Committee's
offices.
Our Committee rules require that all witnesses at
nomination hearings give their testimony under oath, so Mr.
Tisdale, I would ask that you stand and raise your right hand
so that I can administer the oath.
[Oath administered.]
Chairman Collins. Mr. Tisdale, I understand that you have a
statement that you would like to deliver at this time and I
would ask that you proceed.
TESTIMONY OF DAWN A. TISDALE,\1\ OF TEXAS, TO BE COMMISSIONER,
U.S. POSTAL RATE COMMISSION
Mr. Tisdale. Thank you. First of all, I would like to thank
you, Senator Collins and Senator Akaka, for allowing me this
opportunity to come before you. I would further like to thank
the President for his nomination and Senator Daschle for his
support of my recommendation and the nomination. And, most of
all, I would like to thank the Hon. Eddie Bernice Johnson for
being there from the very beginning and for always supporting
this particular nomination.
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\1\ The biographical information and prehearing questions appear in
the Appendix on pages 11 and 15 respectively.
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Just briefly I would like to recap some of my postal
career. I was in the Navy from 1962 to 1966. Following that,
within a couple of months of getting out of the Navy, I was
called to work for the Postal Service and I began work as a
letter carrier in Austin, Texas. I worked there as a letter
carrier for about 14 years, got involved in the union and
eventually became vice president of Local 181 of the National
Association of Letter Carriers in Austin, Texas. During that
time I was also a part of two of the negotiating groups for
local labor contracts with the union.
Following that, I went into management and worked in
delivery growth. In delivery growth we were interested at that
point in convincing people that we should go to centralized
delivery points, rather than to door-to-door delivery and that
is a hard sell for a lot of people, but we managed to do it and
did it successfully.
I followed that up by working at one of the stations in
Austin, the largest station there at the time, as a supervisor
and actually reaped some of the benefits of some of the
negotiations that I had gone through while I worked with
delivery growth.
I followed that by working with employee involvement as the
Postal Service began to change the way it related to its
employees and during that time we worked on showing labor and
management how to better deal with each other, how to do joint
problem-solving, how to prioritize the problems that they
jointly faced.
I followed that by working in labor relations for a long
time and moving on to alternative dispute resolutions.
After that I worked in Waco as manager of employment and
training and when that sectional center was closed I moved to
the job as postmaster in Smithville. I stayed there from 1989
to 2000. In between those years I came back and worked in labor
relations again in Austin and also spent some time working as a
manager of distribution operations in the plant because I
wanted to learn that operation, also.
I retired in 2000 from Smithville as postmaster and enjoyed
a very long and varied career with the Postal Service.
Again I would like to thank you for the opportunity to
answer your questions and at this time I would entertain
whatever questions you have.
Chairman Collins. Thank you for your statement. I will
start my questioning this morning with the standard questions
that we ask all nominees who come before our Committee.
First, is there anything that you are aware of in your
background which might present a conflict of interest with the
duties of the office to which you have been nominated?
Mr. Tisdale. Nothing at all.
Chairman Collins. Second, do you know of anything personal
or otherwise that would in any way prevent you from fully and
honorably discharging the responsibilities of the office to
which you have been nominated?
Mr. Tisdale. Nothing at all.
Chairman Collins. And third, do you agree without
reservation to respond to any reasonable summons to appear and
testify before any duly constituted committee of Congress if
you are confirmed?
Mr. Tisdale. Yes.
Chairman Collins. We will now have a round of questions,
limited to 6 minutes each.
Mr. Tisdale, your experience gives you an insider's
perspective of the Postal Service that is of great interest to
me as we seek to deal with many of the issues raised by the
Presidential Commission. I noticed in your resume that you were
the postmaster of Smithville, Texas and I was curious how big
Smithville, Texas is?
Mr. Tisdale. Smithville has about 3,900 people inside the
city limits. There are about 10,000 in the area.
Chairman Collins. It sounded like a smaller community to
me, typical of the many rural communities that dot the State of
Maine.
As you know, one of the issues that the Presidential
Commission felt strongly about is that the Postal Service needs
to ``constructively address the fact that many of our Nation's
post offices are no longer necessary to the fulfillment of the
universal service obligation.''
I think all of us recognize that there are times when
consolidation can take place but I also know that those post
offices are often essential to elderly people and also play a
role as being the center of the community in a lot of small
towns.
The Commission suggested that existing laws limiting the
Postal Service's ability to close post offices should be
repealed. Given your many years of experience, including as a
postmaster in a small community, could you comment on whether
you believe the current process for closing or consolidating
post offices works well? And how do we balance the need to
provide universal service with the goal of making the Postal
Service more efficient?
Mr. Tisdale. I think that first of all I would say we
probably need to study that issue a little more. But having
been in a small town and watched the people in the communities
around Smithville and how they respond to the Postal Service, I
have to agree that the post offices in those small communities
are very vital. They not only serve as a focal point for the
community but they give the community an identity. To have that
post office there and their own zip code just means a lot to
those people.
I think during the time that I was in Smithville there were
two offices between Smithville and the next larger town over,
which was La Grange, that were closed and I remember the people
coming in and complaining about those offices being closed.
Even though after about a year or so they adjusted to it, they
really did not want those offices closed.
The same services were available and it was within a short
drive for them, 10 miles or so, and I realize in the city we
may drive 5 or 10 miles without thinking about it, but when you
are in a rural community and, as you said, if it is an elderly
person or a person with some type of handicap, then going 10
miles to the post office presents a real problem. But the
people did adjust and they seemed to accept it after a period
of time. But I do believe that before we close any small office
we need to go to that community and talk to the people there
and certainly get their input and that should be a
consideration before that happens.
Chairman Collins. Virtually every witness who has come
before this Committee has testified that the current rate-
making process before the Commission is far too lengthy and
litigious. The Commission has recommended a far more
streamlined process that would give the Postal Service the
ability to establish its rates within a cap and then have an
after-the-fact review that would be available if a complaint
was filed.
There are some who believe that the current process, while
too long and while too litigious, works well to surface all of
the issues and ensure that the best information is available.
Do you have any thoughts on the rate-making process? And do you
have an opinion in particular about the issue of having an
after-the-fact review of rates?
Mr. Tisdale. I think an after-the-fact review of the rate-
setting process would be very bad. The Postal Service goes
through a lot of trouble making sure that people are aware of
rates and changing the rates, both in stamp machines and other
places, and to have an after-the-fact review that goes back and
possibly changes the rates again I think would really be bad
for the agency.
I think that to speed up the process, the current process,
some of the time limits might be reset so that it does not take
quite as long, but some of the other issues I would reserve a
comment on until I was actually there and had a chance to look
at that a little closer.
Chairman Collins. Thank you. Senator Akaka.
Senator Akaka. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman.
Mr. Tisdale, I was very impressed by the introduction of
the congresswoman, which was personal and warm about her
admiration for you. I was also impressed by the experience you
have had in the Postal Service. I guess anybody who is in it
from being a letter carrier is from the bottom up here. You
have had that experience, and you have served the people of
Texas very well as a letter carrier, postal supervisor, and
postmaster. So you can tell by the comments we have made that
we are looking at your experience to help the Postal Service.
I appreciated the detailed explanation of your long career
with the Postal Service. I am saying this because my brother
was in the Postal Service for more than 40 years and he started
as a letter carrier. So I have feelings about the Postal
Service.
But given your experience with alternative dispute
resolution, which is called ADR, how would you incorporate more
ADR into the employee grievance process?
Mr. Tisdale. I do not believe that all of the unions that
work with the Postal Service are currently using alternative
dispute resolution and I think the best thing to do at this
point--I know NALC is heavily involved and I believe the mail
handlers are involved but I do not think the APWU is involved.
I would certainly want to encourage them to become involved and
to use the alternative dispute resolution. I think the success
that the NALC has shown in that process should be held up as a
model for APWU and maybe they would see the light.
Senator Akaka. As a retired postmaster you have had
opportunities to be involved with the closing of post offices.
As Senator Collins noted, these facilities may be the only
contact many citizens have with the Federal Government. In your
comments to her, you discuss post office closings and the need
to involve citizens. How would you do this?
Mr. Tisdale. I would go to the community and set up a
meeting with the community and talk to them about it, allow
them to come in and express their feelings concerning the
closing and the availability of the facilities.
Senator Akaka. I was especially pleased that the
President's Commission rejected privatizing the Postal Service.
Would you share with us your views on privatizing the U.S.
Postal Service?
Mr. Tisdale. I think the U.S. Postal Service does a
fantastic job and the Postal Service goes to places and
delivers mail to people that are not reached by private
enterprise at this point. If you look at some of the places
that people like UPS do not go for reasons of--well, I guess
the reasons are their own but the Postal Service does, then it
is clearly a good reason for not privatizing it. I think
private enterprise would cut out a number of services that the
Postal Service offers as a service to the general public and I
think that access to the services would be severely limited
under private enterprise.
Senator Akaka. Madam Chairman, let me ask my final
question.
Mr. Tisdale, do you believe that the PRC should have a
stronger role in establishing performance standards for postal
products and services and for monitoring the Postal Service's
results in meeting these standards?
Mr. Tisdale. I think the Postal Service already has in
place internal monitoring processes and that those should be
the Postal Service's concern. I think as an oversight
committee, the PRC should take a look at it from time to time
but basically I think the agency itself needs to monitor that.
Senator Akaka. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman.
Chairman Collins. Thank you, Senator. Senator Lautenberg.
OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR LAUTENBERG
Senator Lautenberg. Thank you, Madam Chairman.
This is an important post that has to be filled and I think
we have a really good candidate and I congratulate you, Mr.
Tisdale, because I would say that in these days of partisanship
that if your cause is sponsored by Congresswoman Johnson and
Senator Tom Daschle and can still be nominated by President
Bush, you have to be pretty good. I would say that covers a
fair number of bases.
So we are pleased to see you here. I like your experience.
I think that having been postmaster in such a small town, where
I am sure you knew most, if not all, of the people who you
served, I think that is a particularly good way to view things
because it attaches faces and feelings and concerns when you
are in that small town situation. You get to kind of feel the
flesh and it is a very important thing, I suppose, to the
experience that one typically sees in a larger city where
people become relatively faceless. So I think that is going to
be a very good background for you to call upon as you try to
resolve some of the difficult decisions that you are going to
be making with the Postal Regulatory Board, assuming that that
gets to be the case.
How firmly do you support this enormous expansion of powers
to a three-person board? Do you think that is a good idea, to
be able to really understand what the problems are not just of
the addressee but the employee and the enormous role that the
post office has to bringing our country together? It precedes
any of the now-sophisticated communication networks. People
judge a lot about government when they see how the mail
department, how the postman himself works.
So what do you think about this expansion of powers into
this Postal Regulatory Board?
Mr. Tisdale. I think the expansion of the authorities, it
is probably a good thing in many areas. I tend to question
whether or not three people unattached to the agency could
really have the type of oversight that they would need or the
real understanding of the agency that they would need in order
to have that expanded authority.
I would hope that in the interim the Postal Rate Commission
as it presently exists would be given some of that expanded
authority and that a smooth transition would be able to be had.
Senator Lautenberg. How about rate-setting? Should the
Board of Governors continue to have a role in postage rate-
setting? What kind of changes would you think would be
appropriate for the rate-setting process?
Mr. Tisdale. For the rate-setting process I think the most
immediate role would probably be to shorten the process, to
maybe shorten some of the time limits that are involved at
present. While I do not think it is a good idea to have an
after-the-fact review of the rates, I do think it is a good
idea to have the Postal Service have more autonomy in setting
rates.
Senator Lautenberg. Madam Chairman, I think we have an
excellent candidate. I hope that we will be able to present a
clear picture of all of the responsibilities that are going to
evolve with the Postal Regulatory Board and would tell you, Mr.
Tisdale, that it would be a huge job. This is not going to be a
walk in the park, as you probably know. Maybe even a walk on
the toughest route that you have ever walked. Thank you very
much.
Mr. Tisdale. I would just comment that I have been involved
in change in the Postal Service on a number of issues and I do
understand the agency and the dynamics within the agency when
you are talking about changing something that has gone on for
years.
Senator Lautenberg. Thank you.
Chairman Collins. Thank you.
Mr. Tisdale, I want to thank you for appearing before the
Committee today. I certainly agree with my colleagues that you
are certainly worthy of confirmation and I am pleased to
support your nomination for this very important position at a
time of tremendous transition for the Postal Service.
Without objection, the record will be kept open until 5
p.m. today for the submission of any additional written
questions or statements for the record.
Thank you very much for appearing today and this hearing is
now adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 10:35 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.]
A P P E N D I X
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